Author Topic: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient  (Read 6582 times)

Desertdog

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Three Chreers for Government Run Healthcare.


Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill, but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
LifeSiteNews.com - 6/6/2008 12:05:00 PM
http://www.onenewsnow.com/Culture/Default.aspx?id=130932

SALEM, Oregon - Lung cancer patient, Barbara Wagner, was recently notified that her oncologist-prescribed medication that would slow the growth of cancer would not be covered by the Oregon Health Plan; the plan, however, she was informed, would cover doctor-assisted suicide should she wish to kill herself.

 


 


"Treatment of advanced cancer that is meant to prolong life, or change the course of this disease, is not a covered benefit of the Oregon Health Plan," read the letter notifying Wagner of the health plan's decision.

 

Wagner says she was shocked by the decision. "To say to someone, we'll pay for you to die, but not pay for you to live, it's cruel," she said. "I get angry. Who do they think they are?"

 

This past Monday morning, however, Wagner had reason to rejoice. A representative from the company that manufactures the treatment called the cancer patient to say they would give her the medication for free.

 

"I am just so thrilled," she said. "I am so relieved and so happy."

 

Dr. Walter Shaffer, medical director of the state Division of Medical Assistance Programs, which administers the Oregon Health Plan, attempted to defend the health plan's decision. "We can't cover everything for everyone," he said. "We try to come up with polices that provide the most good for the most people."

 

Shaffer then addressed a priority list that had been developed to ration health care. "There's some desire on the part of the framers of this list to not cover treatments that are futile," he said, "or where the potential benefit to the patient is minimal in relation to the expense of providing the care."

 

According to an AP story on Wagner's case, local oncologists in Oregon have said that, despite the Health Services Commission's assertion that they were just clarifying policies already in place, healthcare practitioners have observed a sizable shift in policy in the way recurrent cancer is treated in the state.

 

Increasingly, say local oncologists, sufferers of recurrent cancer are not receiving coverage for chemotherapy. They are always, however, eligible for state-funded assisted suicide.

 

Wesley J. Smith, a prominent conservative bioethicist, says that he was not surprised by the events.

 

"We have been warning for years that this was a possibility in Oregon. Medicaid is rationed, meaning that some treatments are not covered. But assisted suicide is always covered. And now, Barbara Wagner was faced with that very scenario."

 

Smith also mentioned a similar circumstance that had occurred in the past: "This isn't the first time this has happened either. A few years ago a patient who needed a double organ transplant was denied the treatment but would have been eligible for state-financed assisted suicide."

xavier fremboe

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2008, 03:20:50 AM »
Makes it run like a veterinarian clinic, doesn't it?

I actually had my chemo meds delisted by our HMO after being on it for about a year.  They changed the criteria for the meds (Temodar) to secondary brain tumors instead of primary brain tumors.  The medicine is actually not listed by the pharmaco for secondary brain tumors.  It took about three weeks of phone calls from my neurooncologist, our insurance broker, and me before they would cover the drugs.  I can understand that they didn't want to pay for the meds, as the drug is still covered by patent and cost $5k per round.

It's the same drug they've put Teddy Kennedy on...

[sarcasm]I haven't been offered any publicly funded euthanasia cocktail, but Texas isn't quite as enlightened as Oregon.[/sarcasm]
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El Tejon

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2008, 04:11:30 AM »
Achtung!  Unbrachbare Esser mussen zerstort werden!

*Attention:  Useless Eaters must be destroyed (I think but my German is not top notch)*
I do not smoke pot, wear Wookie suits, live in my mom's basement, collect unemployment checks or eat Cheetoes, therefore I am not a Ron Paul voter.

Tallpine

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2008, 06:11:44 AM »
This will be the "solution" to the Social Security crisis ...  shocked
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

El Tejon

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2008, 06:19:35 AM »
Tall, have you read Boomsday?

http://www.amazon.com/Boomsday-Christopher-Buckley/dp/0446579815

Yes, Obama will soon command you to kill yourself.  In talking to Obama about his plans for "health care" and "SSA reform" I always flashed back to the Star Trek episode where wars were fought via computer and people were ordered to kill themselves.

The future is not always utopian. grin
I do not smoke pot, wear Wookie suits, live in my mom's basement, collect unemployment checks or eat Cheetoes, therefore I am not a Ron Paul voter.

MicroBalrog

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #5 on: June 07, 2008, 06:20:35 AM »
So, if you actually met Obama - and I doubt you very little - why don't you post your memories of meeting him on some forum like Free Republic, where people will read and disseminate this stuff?
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

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El Tejon

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #6 on: June 07, 2008, 06:21:39 AM »
What is Free Republic?

I do not smoke pot, wear Wookie suits, live in my mom's basement, collect unemployment checks or eat Cheetoes, therefore I am not a Ron Paul voter.

Dntsycnt

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #7 on: June 07, 2008, 06:36:39 AM »
Whats the big deal here?

It's a pretty big jump from offering doctor assisted suicide to THE GUBMENT IS MAKING US KILL OURSELVES!

It only makes sense that it would be cheaper to fund one free assisted suicide than continuing medications to keep you clinging to life.  If there's limited funds, and the amount able to be allotted to certain people goes down, than it  only makes sense that the cheaper solutions would be the ones available.

grislyatoms

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #8 on: June 07, 2008, 06:42:07 AM »
Quote
Shaffer then addressed a priority list that had been developed to ration health care. "There's some desire on the part of the framers of this list to not cover treatments that are futile," he said

Aren't all treatments, utimately, futile? Talk about a slippery slope. rolleyes

Quote
"or where the potential benefit to the patient is minimal in relation to the expense of providing the care."

 angry

One of my worst nightmares is to discover that after all these years of paying health insurance premiums I will become stricken with some illness that isn't "covered".


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RocketMan

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #9 on: June 07, 2008, 07:42:02 AM »
It's a pretty big jump from offering doctor assisted suicide to THE GUBMENT IS MAKING US KILL OURSELVES!

But it is a jump that will eventually be made.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

MicroBalrog

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #10 on: June 07, 2008, 07:45:30 AM »
It's a pretty big jump from offering doctor assisted suicide to THE GUBMENT IS MAKING US KILL OURSELVES!

But it is a jump that will eventually be made.

When something is government-subsidized, it means the state wants to encourage it.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

xavier fremboe

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #11 on: June 07, 2008, 07:45:45 AM »
It's a pretty big jump from offering doctor assisted suicide to THE GUBMENT IS MAKING US KILL OURSELVES!

But it is a jump that will eventually be made.
I can see it starting with a financial incentive.
If the bandersnatch seems even mildly frumious, best to shun it.  Really. http://www.cctplastics.com

MicroBalrog

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #12 on: June 07, 2008, 07:46:35 AM »
What is Free Republic?



A large and very-well frequented neocon/Bushite/conservative forum.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

Dntsycnt

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #13 on: June 07, 2008, 07:52:00 AM »
You people actually think the government will force people to commit suicide?  Are you talking in, say, 1000 years or something?  I don't see any logic in such a view.

Sergeant Bob

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #14 on: June 07, 2008, 07:54:56 AM »
What is Free Republic?



A large and very-well frequented neocon/Bushite/conservative forum.

I think you just posted the reason he doesn't know about it. grin

You people actually think the government will force people to commit suicide?  Are you talking in, say, 1000 years or something?  I don't see any logic in such a view.

No, they are not forcing suicide on him, but rather the option of suicide or a slow and very painful death.
Personally, I do not understand how a bunch of people demanding a bigger govt can call themselves anarchist.
I meet lots of folks like this, claim to be anarchist but really they're just liberals with pierced genitals. - gunsmith

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xavier fremboe

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #15 on: June 07, 2008, 08:02:58 AM »
You people actually think the government will force people to commit suicide?  Are you talking in, say, 1000 years or something?  I don't see any logic in such a view.
In a distant dystopian future, a' la Logan's Run, perhaps.  As far as a government sanctioned financial incentive to euthanasia, it already exists.  The death tax will be zero in 2010, but reset back to 55% in 2011.  If you were terminally ill in 2010 it would be a proposition you would definitely consider for the sake of your family.  A 55% haircut on an asset like a family farm would be a huge hit.
If the bandersnatch seems even mildly frumious, best to shun it.  Really. http://www.cctplastics.com

Perd Hapley

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #16 on: June 07, 2008, 08:28:07 AM »
You people actually think the government will force people to commit suicide?  Are you talking in, say, 1000 years or something?  I don't see any logic in such a view.


Google the terms "involuntary euthanasia," "Netherlands" and/or "Holland."  It is reportedly very common there. 
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RocketMan

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #17 on: June 07, 2008, 11:51:23 AM »
You people actually think the government will force people to commit suicide?  Are you talking in, say, 1000 years or something?  I don't see any logic in such a view.

Google the terms "involuntary euthanasia," "Netherlands" and/or "Holland."  It is reportedly very common there. 

Once we have universal or mandatory government-run healthcare here, with ballooning costs and budget cuts, what do you think will eventually be "suggested" to the seriously ill?
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

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Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

41magsnub

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #18 on: June 07, 2008, 11:59:47 AM »
I like the concept of voluntary euthanasia for terminally ill patients, I mean why drag it out if it will be painful and ultimately pointless and cost a buttload of money, but am as wary as the rest of the folks here about scope creep.  I dunno what the answer is.

Otherguy Overby

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #19 on: June 08, 2008, 10:54:53 AM »
I like the concept of voluntary euthanasia for terminally ill patients, I mean why drag it out if it will be painful and ultimately pointless and cost a buttload of money, but am as wary as the rest of the folks here about scope creep.  I dunno what the answer is.

We could recommend euthanasia for politicians upon completion of their first term...
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Tallpine

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #20 on: June 08, 2008, 11:17:09 AM »
I like the concept of voluntary euthanasia for terminally ill patients, I mean why drag it out if it will be painful and ultimately pointless and cost a buttload of money, but am as wary as the rest of the folks here about scope creep.  I dunno what the answer is.

Me too - what else is a .22 pistol good for?  laugh
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

xavier fremboe

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #21 on: June 08, 2008, 11:22:15 AM »
I like the concept of voluntary euthanasia for terminally ill patients, I mean why drag it out if it will be painful and ultimately pointless and cost a buttload of money, but am as wary as the rest of the folks here about scope creep.  I dunno what the answer is.

Me too - what else is a .22 pistol good for?  laugh
Better read over the life insurance policy before staring down the double deuce.  Might void the policy. Wink
If the bandersnatch seems even mildly frumious, best to shun it.  Really. http://www.cctplastics.com

Tallpine

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #22 on: June 08, 2008, 11:38:21 AM »
I was "cleaning it"  laugh
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

MicroBalrog

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #23 on: June 08, 2008, 11:44:57 AM »
Killing yourself with a .22 is beyond a bad idea. Botch it, and remain alive -but braindamaged and unable to try again.

...should we start a "best round for suicide" thread? grin
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roo_ster

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Re: Oregon Offers to Pay to Kill (self) but Not to Treat Cancer Patient
« Reply #24 on: June 08, 2008, 12:35:28 PM »
A college buddy of mine managed to complete the task of offing himself with a .22LR rifle.  He wasn't a gun guy, but sharp enough to figure out how to complete the task given the tools at hand.
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roo_ster

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