Lucas fuel treatment?

[MillCreek]

A bunch of us from the local bicycle club met up for a trail ride yesterday.  Afterwards, the conversation turned to motorcycles.  One of the members had just bought a new Kawasaki Vulcan cruiser.  Some of the other guys started advising him to use Lucas fuel treatment and that they did so for all of their motorized vehicles.  Some people think it may be of particular value in higher-compression engines, like a typical large motorcycle, and may be of special value during the break-in period for the rings and pistons. 

I came home and read about this on the Net.  Some people think it is the bees' knees while others think it, and other fuel treatments, are so much expensive junk.  It seems to be very popular in the commercial trucking area. 

We have a lot of gearheads on this board.  What say you about Lucas?  Should I start using this in the maxi-scooter and the Suzuki dual-sport?  What about the Mazda pickup and the Ford Escape?  Is it going to give me better performance, mileage or enhance the longevity of the engines?   

[Manedwolf]

It doesn't do anything magical, but it's pretty harmless and possibly helpful as an injector cleaner and valve lubricant...

I run a bottle every now and then, and Redline fuel system cleaner a bit less frequently. Yes, it does keep things cleaner, which can extend the life of the engine significantly. And the exhaust temp is notably hotter when there's a bottle of that in the tank.

Of all the car mod boards I'm on, where people compete seriously, they always seem to agree that Lucas and Redline are good products, but that some of the "gas station brand" ones carried in wal-mart, as well as the "OMG NITRO EXTREME" ones in metal cans with lightning bolts...are just a bottle of solvent. Redline is about 50% polyether amines, whereas some of the store brands can be like...2%. So both it and Lucas seem to be well regarded.

[seeker_two]

I don't know about motorcycles, but I usually run a bottle of Berryman B12 in my truck's gas tank after each oil change and a bottle of RXP on every third oil change....still running and approaching 150K with no major problems.....

[Nick1911]

Eh, I never use that stuff.

I don't see what harm can come of it, but I also don't understand how it will improve anything either.

[Manedwolf]

Eh, I never use that stuff.

I don't see what harm can come of it, but I also don't understand how it will improve anything either.

It does have an effect. If I go without cleaning it for a while, the sensor reads on fuel richness and injector status and the like start varying a bit. If I use that stuff, they immediately stay precise and stay that way for several months, so I'd decided that yes, it is keeping crap out of things that throw off maximum engine efficiency. So it's worth it, to me.

[Brad Johnson]

If the bike is new it's tuned to run on today's fuels.  Use the recommended fuel type and leave the treatments on the shelf.

Brad

[Manedwolf]

If the bike is new it's tuned to run on today's fuels.  Use the recommended fuel type and leave the treatments on the shelf.

Brad

I'm more thinking of the crap sucked up from ground tanks that aren't cleaned often enough. Things that make it through the fuel filter, and, in the long term, gum up stuff. A dose of something that dissolves deposits and burns off crap seems to work.

Not needed in any brand-new vehicle, but to keep it cleaned out later.

[MillCreek]

I wonder if Lucas has any fuel-stabilizing properties like STA-BIL.  I use some of that in the scooter and motorcycle during the winter months.  Since depending on the weather, I may not get to ride them for a month or two at a time.  

[Nick1911]

It does have an effect. If I go without cleaning it for a while, the sensor reads on fuel richness and injector status and the like start varying a bit. If I use that stuff, they immediately stay precise and stay that way for several months, so I'd decided that yes, it is keeping crap out of things that throw off maximum engine efficiency. So it's worth it, to me.

That's interesting.

Do you have an after market ECU that lets you peak at these variables?  I've been thinking about building a microcontroller based board that would let me read and log that kind of data on my laptop. (EGT, MAF reading, IAT, O2 Sensor, Cyl Head Temp, etc.)

[Manedwolf]

That's interesting.

Do you have an after market ECU that lets you peak at these variables?  I've been thinking about building a microcontroller based board that would let me read and log that kind of data on my laptop. (EGT, MAF reading, IAT, O2 Sensor, Cyl Head Temp, etc.)

Yes, I'd had an AutoEnginuity ScanTool interface for Windows Mobile for a long time, and I'm looking into the newer ones that work with the iPod Touch.

The old one would output data right into an Excel spreadsheet, but it crashed sometimes.

You don't need to build anything, there's a whole lot of stuff on the market now that'll plug between your OBD-II port and USB, with software suite. :) How much data you can get, (Mass Air Flow sensor data, O2 sensor data, exhaust temp, spark voltage and such) depends on your car and how many sensors it has reporting back to its ECU.

[Nick1911]

Yes, I'd had an AutoEnginuity ScanTool interface for Windows Mobile for a long time, and I'm looking into the newer ones that work with the iPod Touch.

The old one would output data right into an Excel spreadsheet, but it crashed sometimes.

You don't need to build anything, there's a whole lot of stuff on the market now that'll plug between your OBD-II port and USB, with software suite. :) How much data you can get, (O2 sensor data, exhaust temp, spark voltage and such) depends on your car and how many sensors it has reporting back to its ECU.

Cool!

Except my cars don't have OBD-II ports - too old. 

[Manedwolf]

Cool!

Except my cars don't have OBD-II ports - too old. 

Thaaaaat's a problem. No idea, then, sorry! The things I'm familiar with just plug into the OBD-II port under the dash and pull the sensor data in realtime. You might need to install new senders and go through the firewall to something aftermarket...I don't know how that'd work.

[Manedwolf]

BTW, painful-amusing sensor cautionary tale, or "why CAIs can be bad."

Someone I know had one, mounted low, almost to the bumper. They hit a puddle at pretty good speed. The "bypass" didn't work a damn. They sucked up water, almost hydrolocked the engine, and did in fact destroy the MAF sensor, which costs...a surprising amount of money.

That is why my intake is in the same location as the stock one.

[Rudy Kohn]

A while after I got my '86 300ZX a few years ago, I ran this for a few tanks and gained a few (2-4) MPG.  However, I think the rate at which dirt builds up is pretty slow, as further treatments didn't do much of anything.  I still ran it in a tank every 6 mos. or so.  Didn't hurt anything.  I gave my extra Lucas to a neighbor, who used it and thought it helped, too.

I think it may help a bit when injectors/fuel pump/etc. are really dirty, but otherwise, doesn't do much of anything.  I don't think it has any fuel-stabilizing properties.  Even modern fuels have a little bit of impurity.

Get one or two of the little single-treatment bottles and give it a try, assuming you don't run any other injector cleaning/fuel treatments with any frequency.  You might see a little difference.  If not, you're out what, $6?

[MechAg94]

I had some idle problems on my truck and used a bottle or two of sea foam or however you spell it.  It seemed to make a difference.  I agree on using stuff like that to clean things out occasionally.

[Manedwolf]

Yes, get the single-treatment bottles. Cheaper, and you don't risk contamination with an open bottle of something to be added to your fuel system.

Oh, and Sea Foam? Hee hee...if you want to clean out a really cruddy crankcase, and horrify neighbors, you add some of that via the PCV valve.
Don't drive anywhere where you like people, because you'll be putting out movie-smokescreen amounts of smoke till it burns off.

[Strings]

Heh... had a friend do a full seafoam treatment on one of my old roomie's cars. Left the car in the garage as it ran (and smoke was pouring off it) to run inside and ask "Hey... where are he fire extinguishers?"

I was rolling when Darren came out (thankfully, he HAD put pants on. Seems he was "busy" when the friend came in)...

[Manedwolf]

Heh... had a friend do a full seafoam treatment on one of my old roomie's cars. Left the car in the garage as it ran (and smoke was pouring off it) to run inside and ask "Hey... where are he fire extinguishers?"

I was rolling when Darren came out (thankfully, he HAD put pants on. Seems he was "busy" when the friend came in)...

Avg. sea foam smoke amount...

[crt360]

It's mostly Maui wowie, but it's got some labrador in it.

[French G.]

BTW, painful-amusing sensor cautionary tale, or "why CAIs can be bad."

Someone I know had one, mounted low, almost to the bumper. They hit a puddle at pretty good speed. The "bypass" didn't work a damn. They sucked up water, almost hydrolocked the engine, and did in fact destroy the MAF sensor, which costs...a surprising amount of money.

That is why my intake is in the same location as the stock one.

Somewhere I have a pic I took of one of the fast and the fabulous. Their front fascia was ripped off, probably by a speedbump, leaving me with a great view of their expensive K&N sitting 1" off the ground. This in a parking lot that had flooded up to door handle level the previous week.  :rolleyes:

I use Lucas occasionally, pretty good stuff, run their oil additive straight in my transfer case. If I wanted to put something in my fuel regularly it would be a good top lube like Klotz Uplon. My old Ford has issues, occasionally I run B-12 or Seafoam through the gas or just snorkel it into the intake through a vacuum line with the motor running, cleans a lot of crap off the valves.

[MechAg94]

My GMC Sierra didn't smoke at all with Sea Foam.  We are talking about the stuff you put in with a full tank of gas right? 

A long long long time ago I drove a 1984 Chevy S10.  With the vacuum lines all a mess, it smoked bad.  That improved a good bit once I fixed up some of the vacuum lines.  I'm glad I don't drive that thing anymore, but it was a good little truck.

[myrockfight]

My GMC Sierra didn't smoke at all with Sea Foam.  We are talking about the stuff you put in with a full tank of gas right? 

I think they are talking about the stuff you put in the engine block. You sound like you are talking about fuel additive. No?

[Manedwolf]

Sea Foam can be used as either fuel additive, where it will not smoke, or carefully added a tiny bit at a time through an appropriate vacuum connector to the crankcase, where it will generate massive smoke.

There is a specific procedure for doing that that's detailed all over the web.

[nico]

decent fuel system cleaners (Lucas and Redline are the the first ones I think of) when added every tank basically do the job of good gas detergents and can make up for gas with lower quality detergents.  fwiw, my gas mileage is generally a few mpg better with Lucas fuel system cleaner than without. 

[Tuco]

Or, just run a half a quart of ATF every five fillups or so....