Author Topic: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized  (Read 9265 times)

AZRedhawk44

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Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« on: November 18, 2010, 03:02:35 PM »
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/local/Officer-fined-_185-for-speeding-in-crash-that-paralyzed-boy-1597329-108773219.html

Pay $185, confess to speeding while off-duty on your way to your moonlight job and using the police cruiser to get there, get away with paralyzing a 14 year old boy.

Not fired.

Not prosecuted.

Not PERSONALLY culpable for the damages.  The COUNTY paid $400k to the injured boy's family for hospital bills.  Cokinos didn't pay a dime aside from his speeding violation.
"But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist."
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MillCreek

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2010, 03:19:15 PM »
When I first read this post, my risk manager side said "This seems to be outside the scope of his employment, I wonder why the county covered the civil liability".  

I then read the article and saw that the officer was in uniform and driving his police cruiser, so there could be a reasonable presumption that he could be considered on-duty, and the employer is vicariously liable for his actions.  But more importantly, by claiming he was 'on-duty', so to speak, the county's legal liability was limited by governmental immunity to $ 200,000 per claim.  With the one claim of the child and the claim of the parents, it adds up to the $ 400,000 paid by the county.  If they weren't shielded by the governmental immunity, the county would have paid much, much more.  So from the county's perspective, it was a good decision to claim that they were responsible for the officer, even if he was off-duty and moonlighting.  It kept down their costs, thus saving the taxpayers money.   ;/

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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2010, 03:24:43 PM »
Not prosecuted.


hmmm


Cokinos, who was 23 at the time, was speeding at 56 miles an hour in a 30-mile-an-hour zone when he struck Luis -- who was crossing Springtown Road in front of his home.

Seven months later in November, a Montgomery County District Court judge found Cokinos not guilty of negligent driving or contributing to an accident.

Cokinos then pleaded guilty to driving 26 miles-per-hour over the limit and he paid a $185 fine, including a $25 court fee.

A police investigation concluded that the boy would not have been hit had Cokinos been traveling at the speed limit, however.


Read more at the Washington Examiner: http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/local/Officer-fined-_185-for-speeding-in-crash-that-paralyzed-boy-1597329-108773219.html#ixzz15fSH43hK
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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AZRedhawk44

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2010, 03:27:57 PM »
Sorry, I meant "not convicted."

The cop went for a trial by judge rather than trial by jury.

The judge acquitted him, despite clear negligence (IMO).  56 in a 30 and smacking into a kid, while moonlighting in a patrol vehicle.  The institution protecting its own.
"But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist."
--Lysander Spooner

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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #4 on: November 18, 2010, 03:32:40 PM »
trial by judge is pretty commonplace in those cases.  is it your view he should be compelled to face a jury trial?  that for some reason hes waived his right to choice there? and to a legal defense?   the stories a bit sparse   what was his defense? who was his lawyer?  who was the judge?  i know its the examiner but this is their home turf  . any links to more details?
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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Seenterman

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2010, 03:42:01 PM »
Quote
trial by judge is pretty commonplace in those cases.
Ummm . . . I wonder why?
One hand washes another. Judges, Prosecutors, and Cops all look out for one another.

Quote
Cokinos, who was 23 at the time, was speeding at 56 miles an hour in a 30-mile-an-hour zone ...

Seven months later in November, a Montgomery County District Court judge found Cokinos not guilty of negligent driving or contributing to an accident.

HOW? He was doing almost double the speed limit! How can anyone look at this case and not conclude its a miscarriage of justice? I'd love the hear this scumbag of a judge's reasoning for why this cop isn't guilty of negligent driving and worse.

cassandra and sara's daddy

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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2010, 03:44:17 PM »
Ummm . . . I wonder why?
One hand washes another. Judges, Prosecutors, and Cops all look out for one another.

HOW? He was doing almost double the speed limit! How can anyone look at this case and not conclude its a miscarriage of justice? I'd love the hear this scumbag of a judge's reasoning for why this cop isn't guilty of negligent driving and worse.



take the time to find out then  don't count on the examiner

most traffic cases are judge trials  in fact asking for a jury can cause some interesting machinations in the smaller cases.

It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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Brad Johnson

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2010, 04:22:39 PM »
I know I'll probably get flamed for asking this, but why didn't the kid look before he crossed the street?

Brad
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AZRedhawk44

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #9 on: November 18, 2010, 04:26:05 PM »
I know I'll probably get flamed for asking this, but why didn't the kid look before he crossed the street?

Brad

Because the car was outside visual detection when he entered the street, but at twice the speed limit it rounded the corner faster than a reasonable person could get out of the way?
"But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist."
--Lysander Spooner

I reject your authoritah!

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2010, 04:35:05 PM »
Because the car was outside visual detection when he entered the street, but at twice the speed limit it rounded the corner faster than a reasonable person could get out of the way?

thats a good guess   you should work for balko
look at the picture of the site in the first gazette article i posted
http://www.gazette.net/images/2008_0507/boyreactd050708b_rgbb.jpg
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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cassandra and sara's daddy

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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

AZRedhawk44

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2010, 04:39:04 PM »
Since you're so well researched on the matter, why don't you give us an address of the accident site so we can look it up on Google earth?

Your pic only shows one approach.  The other approach may have a curve.

Straight rural roads like that are typically 45-50mph speed limits unless there are curves or other reasons to go slower.  This one is obviously 30mph for some reason.
"But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist."
--Lysander Spooner

I reject your authoritah!

Strings

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2010, 05:52:03 PM »
Even assuming that there are no curves, it would be fairly easy for a pedestrian to misjudge the speed the car was traveling at...
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2010, 06:28:29 PM »
Since you're so well researched on the matter, why don't you give us an address of the accident site so we can look it up on Google earth?

Your pic only shows one approach.  The other approach may have a curve.

Straight rural roads like that are typically 45-50mph speed limits unless there are curves or other reasons to go slower.  This one is obviously 30mph for some reason.

it drops to 30 at the road mentioned in the article  and all are visible on the google link
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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Battle Monkey of Zardoz

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2010, 12:56:51 AM »
Quote
pedestrian to misjudge the speed the car was traveling at...

HMmM, you would think a cop would know the traffic laws, since he has probably pulled people over and wrote tickets for the same thing he did.  Yes, the Blue Line is alive and well on this one.  Trying to defend the cops actions tells me what powers you think are alright for police to have. 

If it were my kid, well......I will stop there
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #16 on: November 19, 2010, 01:03:18 PM »
truly sorry the kids hurt  but i'm guessing you didn't read the articles beyond the examiner
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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tyme

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #17 on: November 19, 2010, 09:32:01 PM »
I have to agree with Brad and CaSD.  The kid wasn't paralyzed or blind before the accident, was he?  A 14-year-old who gets hit by a car outside of a crosswalk should be declared a sacrifice to Darwin and everyone should move on.  I say this having run cross country/track in HS and thus having jaywalked in city traffic thousands of times.

Of course it's a tragedy, but not all tragedies are the fault of the survivor(s).
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #18 on: November 20, 2010, 12:36:48 AM »
its unfortunate that some media chose to pander to their fanbois with sensational headlines that dance around the truth. more unfortunate that folks don't look closer and call em out for their "journalism"
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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zahc

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #19 on: November 20, 2010, 11:30:17 AM »
Quote
you would think a cop would know the traffic laws, since he has probably pulled people over and wrote tickets for the same thing he did.

Cops don't know the law, they just enforce it.
Maybe a rare occurence, but then you only have to get murdered once to ruin your whole day.
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #20 on: November 20, 2010, 01:44:51 PM »
i think he knows the speeding law  just not the limit on that road  its a big county  i drove cab 5 years in it never was on that road.
so which examiner article did you read?
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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vaskidmark

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #21 on: November 20, 2010, 02:19:36 PM »
OK, what's the real point?  Where are there secondary roads with 55 mph speed limits in the county?  How many of them are there?

If the cop knows the laws regarding speeding he knows that they are broken down not only by x-number-of-mph-over-the-posted-limit but x-mph-based-on-type/location-of-road (secondary urban vs secondary rural -- usually defined by distance between houses alongside the road), etc.

And cops everywhere regularly exceeed the posted limit without using lights and/or siren just because they want to.  I routinely stop by my local cop-shop to talk with the watch commander and submit a written complaint about the cop that passed me exceeding the limit without warning devices on.  It's not just that it's breaking the lawe - which frosts me no end - but that it's costing tax dollars they don't have.  So far, AFAIK, all it gets is the cop chewed out because the watch commander has to submit a written response back to me about whether or not cop rules/policy were violated.  I really don't expect much more, and the cops know better than to harass me over it as that will get them hauled on the carpet for official action.

The point being, if he was exceeding the speed limit and doing so outside of established policy/procedure then he was not doing it in the line of duty and loses qualified immunity. That the agency is not dealing with him open them to vicarious liability.  Even in the 4th Circuit which is notorious for "protecting" cops.  but in state court the penalties are even more severe and the liability even steeper.

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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #22 on: November 20, 2010, 02:28:40 PM »
in that part of clarksburg on that road limit is 50 less than 3 miles from the accident
i'm not aware of any true secondary roads that are 55
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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MechAg94

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #23 on: November 23, 2010, 05:43:31 PM »
Quote
- There were 124 feet of skid marks left on the road by the cruiser,-

the police report says,

- and investigators noted two scuff marks that matched the color of Jovel's sneakers after 40 feet of skid marks. The cruiser slid another 80 feet before coming to a stop.-

"The investigation and report speak for itself," Starks said.
40 feet of skid marks before with a slight delay before hitting the brakes.  That is a very short distance at any speed (4 or 5 car lengths?) Did the kid run out into the road without looking?  That is the only reason I can think of that it went the way it did.  

I've seen plenty of roads that size down here with houses near the road and speed limits of 45 to 60.
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Thin Blue Line: Institutionalized
« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2010, 05:52:30 PM »
statist!  that not what that highly informative article in the examiner said
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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