Author Topic: Eric garner verdict  (Read 15774 times)

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #75 on: December 05, 2014, 11:13:25 AM »
Pretty much my take on it.  If the state must have its pound of flesh, then write him a ticket.  If you have to serve a warrant on him later because he doesn't pay, then a) it's the court's decision that he needs to go to jail, not the officer's and b) the arrest is for failure to appear, not for a pathetic little infraction.
What woulda happened is they take him book him release him with a summons. Like the previous times.
This time he made a decision " to not go down like that"


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HankB

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #76 on: December 05, 2014, 11:31:37 AM »
If LEOs are willing to arrest and kill citizens to keep folk from selling single cigarettes, they will be willing to kill citizens for any reason, no matter how minor, unjust, or unconstitutional.
Heard on the radio (so it must be 100% true) that the watch commander sent a group of cops out there because of "citizen complaints" about the selling of single cigarettes and that a police sergeant - who happened to be black - on the scene ordered the arrest and takedown.

So if true, the decision to use a WHOLE SQUAD of cops to stop the sale of single cigarettes AT ANY COST was made from up on high . . . and the officers were simply following orders.
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #77 on: December 05, 2014, 11:44:11 AM »
It's even better hank. It's one of bloom ergs innitiatives. New law and the whole kaboodle


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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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KD5NRH

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #78 on: December 05, 2014, 12:07:10 PM »
What woulda happened is they take him book him release him with a summons. Like the previous times.

Then why take him in at all?  Write a ticket right there, and hand it to him.  Take a picture or video of the cop handing it to him in case he refuses or you need to verify it's him later.  If he refuses to accept or sign the ticket, then make the arrest.

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #79 on: December 05, 2014, 12:13:30 PM »
Then why take him in at all?  Write a ticket right there, and hand it to him.  Take a picture or video of the cop handing it to him in case he refuses or you need to verify it's him later.  If he refuses to accept or sign the ticket, then make the arrest.

Because of LEOs suffering from Cartman-Arendt Syndrome.
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Scout26

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #80 on: December 05, 2014, 12:21:05 PM »
Scout

When were you there?  Graf Hohenfels Bayreuth Vilseck 1988-93

And yes I agree. Civilian Police can't hold a candle to MP training.

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Scout26

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #81 on: December 05, 2014, 12:27:41 PM »
I've heard rumours that Garner had just broken up a fight and was not selling "Looseys" (individual cigarettes).  In fact, when "apprehended" he didn't have any cigarettes on him at all.
Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help.


Bring me my Broadsword and a clear understanding.
Get up to the roundhouse on the cliff-top standing.
Take women and children and bed them down.
Bless with a hard heart those that stand with me.
Bless the women and children who firm our hands.
Put our backs to the north wind.
Hold fast by the river.
Sweet memories to drive us on,
for the motherland.

zxcvbob

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #82 on: December 05, 2014, 12:30:38 PM »
Not sure why we argue with him at all.

1) He keeps us from devolving into an echo chamber
2) Every once in a while, he's right. (and that's really annoying)
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #83 on: December 05, 2014, 12:39:06 PM »
Then why take him in at all?  Write a ticket right there, and hand it to him.  Take a picture or video of the cop handing it to him in case he refuses or you need to verify it's him later.  If he refuses to accept or sign the ticket, then make the arrest.
part of bloomies initiatives. And there was an order fro a "crackdown" . That happened under deblasio


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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #84 on: December 05, 2014, 12:40:48 PM »
I've heard rumours that Garner had just broken up a fight and was not selling "Looseys" (individual cigarettes).  In fact, when "apprehended" he didn't have any cigarettes on him at all.
I heard that too
I also saw that cops had observed him selling
And his home boy admits on video that Eric was selling cigs. Everyone know dat. He gotta make a living

He was supposedly so breathing impaired he had to rest if he walked a block


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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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Jocassee

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #85 on: December 05, 2014, 12:54:38 PM »


He was supposedly so breathing impaired he had to rest if he walked a block


Side note--how do you get that bad at 43?
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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #86 on: December 05, 2014, 01:04:25 PM »
Nypd doesn't give tasers to everyone too concerned how it looks might offend someone's sensibilities


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I'd rather piss/*expletive deleted*it my pants and have a small chance of a heart attack than be choked to death.
Spending several hours in my own filth or waking up chained to a hospital bed seems like it'd be better than not waking up...

Assuming,of course,that any physical action needed to be taken,that is.
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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #87 on: December 05, 2014, 01:05:24 PM »
Side note--how do you get that bad at 43?

Heavy smoking with asthma, morbid obesity, etc.

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #88 on: December 05, 2014, 01:15:47 PM »
My younger brother smoked three packs of cowboy killers a day from age 14 . Was diagnosed emphysema at 41 or 42' kept smoking till 48. It's not pretty


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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #89 on: December 05, 2014, 01:16:54 PM »
I'd rather piss/*expletive deleted*it my pants and have a small chance of a heart attack than be choked to death.
Spending several hours in my own filth or waking up chained to a hospital bed seems like it'd be better than not waking up...

Assuming,of course,that any physical action needed to be taken,that is.
I agree tasers make a lot of sense. But we live in a world where "feelings" rule not facts and common sense.


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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

Monkeyleg

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #90 on: December 05, 2014, 01:47:06 PM »
Rand Paul made an observation about this case, for which he's taking flak. He should have chosen his words better.

He said:

Quote
"I think it's hard not to watch that video of him saying, 'I can't breathe, I can't breathe,' and not be horrified by it," Paul said. "But I think there's something bigger than the individual circumstances. ... I think it's also important to know that some politician put a tax of $5.85 on a pack of cigarettes, so that's driven cigarettes underground by making them so expensive. But then some politician also had to direct the police to say, 'Hey we want you arresting people for selling a loose cigarette.'... For someone to die over breaking that law, there really is no excuse for it. But I do blame the politicians. We put our police in a difficult situation with bad laws."

What's true about that statement is that, when politicians write laws, the laws must be enforced. The police must use whatever means necessary to enforce the laws. In this case they had to take the guy to the ground, and he died. If there had been no tax on cigarettes, or at least no tax so high that a profit can be made from selling them illegally, then there would have been no reason for the police to even approach Garner. But they had to, because some politicians wrote that law.

Politicians never seem to take into account the fact that the laws they write must, in the worst case scenarios, be enforced using lethal force.

HankB

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #91 on: December 05, 2014, 03:14:31 PM »
Then why take him in at all?  Write a ticket right there, and hand it to him.  Take a picture or video of the cop handing it to him in case he refuses or you need to verify it's him later.  If he refuses to accept or sign the ticket, then make the arrest.
Probably a case of "While you may beat the rap, you sure won't beat the ride".
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MillCreek

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #92 on: December 05, 2014, 03:15:32 PM »
I've been spending time over here http://www.forcescience.org/fs-news.html looking at info on Excited Delerium Syndrome (EDS).

Comments?  Questions?  Am I the only one who has ever heard of EDS?

stay safe.

Excited delirium is well-known in the emergency medical services community.
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MillCreek
Snohomish County, WA  USA


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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #93 on: December 05, 2014, 03:32:01 PM »
Probably a case of "While you may beat the rap, you sure won't beat the ride".

The ride and process are again part of bloombergs "initiatives"


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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

Battle Monkey of Zardoz

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #94 on: December 05, 2014, 07:24:45 PM »
Probably a case of "While you may beat the rap, you sure won't beat the ride".

I hate that saying. "You may beat the rap, but not the ride". Hate it. Used to go off on cops I worked with when they would say that. Damn stupid statement. If your thst unsure and the suspect may beat the rap, maybe just maybe he / she is not guilty and their is no need for the ride.

As I've said before, I'm sure I'll get another "your a cop hater" message-  LE is getting what they deserve. If LE wants to know who is at fault, they only need to look in the mirror. The militarization of police has started to bite them in the arse
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #95 on: December 05, 2014, 08:20:46 PM »
One could say the people get what they deserve. They vote in the people who pass the laws the cops have to enforce


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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

Battle Monkey of Zardoz

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #96 on: December 05, 2014, 08:26:29 PM »
One could say the people get what they deserve. They vote in the people who pass the laws the cops have to enforce


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The I'm just following orders excuse. Been tried over in Europe starting in the 30's. Didn't hold water then and doesn't today
“We the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution.”

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #97 on: December 05, 2014, 08:29:33 PM »
Rand Paul made an observation about this case, for which he's taking flak. He should have chosen his words better.

He said:

What's true about that statement is that, when politicians write laws, the laws must be enforced. The police must use whatever means necessary to enforce the laws. In this case they had to take the guy to the ground, and he died. If there had been no tax on cigarettes, or at least no tax so high that a profit can be made from selling them illegally, then there would have been no reason for the police to even approach Garner. But they had to, because some politicians wrote that law.

Politicians never seem to take into account the fact that the laws they write must, in the worst case scenarios, be enforced using lethal force.

This says it all
Quote
We put our police in a difficult situation with bad laws."
JD

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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Eric garner verdict
« Reply #98 on: December 05, 2014, 08:29:38 PM »
Folks were following orders when they voted for bloomie? They passed a law about loosies and deblasios regime ordered the crackdown


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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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Ron

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Re: Eric garner verdict
« Reply #99 on: December 05, 2014, 11:14:32 PM »
3. Arresting someone for selling individual cigarettes?  Really?  


Quote
Garner died because he dared interfere with government reach and government muscle that didn't want to lose tax revenue to independent operators.

That's what Garner was doing, denying government its taxes by selling black market cigarettes a few at a time. And New York officials put out the word to stop it. And it was stopped. And Garner died.
www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/kass/ct-eric-garner-kass-met-1205-20141205-column.html

Someone told the cops where they should focus their energy. "Following orders" may not be a defense but why not focus the energy where the rot begins? At the top.

For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse. Because knowing God, they didn’t glorify him as God, and didn’t give thanks, but became vain in their reasoning, and their senseless heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools.