"Scientists" more prone to believe in the dangers of overpopulation

[Perd Hapley]

That's what I found surprising about this article. (Or the first two paragraphs, which are all I read.)

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/wireStory/poll-shows-giant-gap-public-scientists-28583862

[Tuco]

That's what I found surprising about this article. (Or the first two paragraphs, which are all I read.)

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/wireStory/poll-shows-giant-gap-public-scientists-28583862

People didn't believe Malthus, either.
No,
Wait.

[Ron]

Follow the money

[cambeul41]

Eighty-seven percent of scientists said global warming is mostly due to human activity, while only half of the public did.

But Ron wisely suggests that we . . .

Follow the money

[MechAg94]

In eight of 13 science-oriented issues, there was a 20-percentage-point or higher gap separating the opinions of the public and members of the American Association for the Advancement of Science, according to survey work by the Pew Research Center. The gaps didn't correlate to any liberal-conservative split; the scientists at times take more traditionally conservative views and at times more liberal.

Who is the American Association for the Advancemetn of Science and what is their membership?  Anyone know?

Just curious since all the "scientists" polled are in that organization.  Do they have any general political leaning and such?

[MechAg94]

I would also be curious if the polling was equally different if they narrowed the "public" side of the poll to college graduates or somehow filtered out completely non-technical people. 

[Ron]

Our modern secular priesthood has its own dogma.

If you want to be part of the new mystery religion you must accept the doctrine of the depravity of the human race in its sinning against planet earth. We are not part of the system but a plague or parasite that is killing its host.

The apocalypse will occur unless we heed our priests and prophets of scientism. They will lead us in the way of sustainability. The masses will have to suffer a lesser lifestyle with fewer children to save earth; even as our betters are allowed to breed and consume as they see fit, as depicting their elevated station in life :D     

[GigaBuist]

I would also be curious if the polling was equally different if they narrowed the "public" side of the poll to college graduates or somehow filtered out completely non-technical people. 

I doubt it would change.  Educated liberals are mostly making up the anti-vaccine crowd.  I've seen STEM type guys all over the board with GMO and pesticides and such.

You'd get a bigger swing in how you phrased the questions because the problem isn't intellect (rare that I say that) but rather raw knowledge and we all know from political polling on the gun issue phrasing means a lot. 

Let's take GMO crops for instance.

Q1: "Do you think genetically modified crops are safe?"
... You'll get answers of No a lot on that one from the general public.  Because the question gives them very little information.

Q1A: "Do you think corn crops that have been sprayed with a natural organic pesticide that has never been known to cause harm to humans is safe?"
... You'll get a Yes out of most on that one.
Q2A: "Do you think corn that can make this organic pesticide on its own is safer to eat than crops treated with more traditional organophosphate insecticide, a chemical class created during WWII mostly intended to kill other human beings but was also adopted to kill insects?"
... You'll probably get a yes out of that one too. But the same person might object to GMOs if just ask them about GMOs.

People are stupid.  I'm sorry.  Oklahoma State University just came out with a study and a throw-away question was should food that contains DNA be labeled as such; 80% of the survey takers said yes.

You can't rationalize with the general public.  You just deal with them.

[Perd Hapley]

Who is the American Association for the Advancemetn of Science and what is their membership?  Anyone know?

Just curious since all the "scientists" polled are in that organization.  Do they have any general political leaning and such?

Oh, you noticed that, too?

Educated liberals are mostly making up the anti-vaccine crowd. 

This really surprises me. I can't recall where I read it (probably vaccines screwing up my memory).

[MillCreek]

I am surprised that you all are unfamiliar with the AAAS.  It is the world's largest general scientific society covering a wide spectrum of scientific studies.  Their main journal, Science, is one of the best science academic journals in the world.  Their primary aim is to use science for the betterment of people.

[charby]

I doubt it would change.  Educated liberals are mostly making up the anti-vaccine crowd.  I've seen STEM type guys all over the board with GMO and pesticides and such.

Weird, almost all the anti vax people I know are non college educated uber conservatives. Mostly they don't understand herd immunity and scared that their kid is going to be the 1:100k that is allergic to the vaccine and will die.

I'm a STEM educated person, and I have mixed opinions on GMO crops. Not because they are bad for human consumption, but what will they mutate into in the future. Also with smartstax crops, the producer quit practicing integrated pest management and now we have some pretty noxious resistant weeds and other pests. Such as round up ready corn and soy, where the producer just Glyphosate'd the world, or with BT corn and not planting non BT refuge in the field.

[MillCreek]

Weird, almost all the anti vax people I know are non college educated uber conservatives. Mostly they don't understand herd immunity and scared that their kid is going to be the 1:100k that is allergic to the vaccine and will die.

When I worked for the healthcare systems that primarily took care of middle-class patients, the anti-vax people were almost always white women, presumably educated.  When I worked for the healthcare systems that primarily took care of poor people, almost none of them are anti-vax.  Interesting, and this may be entirely a function of the area (the greater Seattle area) in which I have worked.

[charby]

When I worked for the healthcare systems that primarily took care of middle-class patients, the anti-vax people were almost always white women, presumably educated.  When I worked for the healthcare systems that primarily took care of poor people, almost none of them are anti-vax.  Interesting, and this may be entirely a function of the area (the greater Seattle area) in which I have worked.

I can see poor people being like that, especially with a good public health education policy. Be vaccinated, reduce your time (and cost of) being sick.

[Perd Hapley]

The only anti-vaxer I can think of, off-hand, is Conspiracy Cow-Orker; a college-educated, middle-class, white guy. He says that his nephew (or somebody) was a perfectly normal child until he got vaxxed, and has not spoken a word since. It made him autistic. CC doesn't trust much of anything out of modern medicine, or the FDA that "tells you what you have to eat, and what drugs you have to take."

[Tuco]

Oklahoma State University just came out with a study and a throw-away question was should food that contains DNA be labeled as such; 80% of the survey takers said yes.

Simply delicious.

[Ron]

Most articles I've read lay the anti vax hysteria at the feet of liberals.

Here is a non scientific "study" of the phenomenon.

http://www.realclearscience.com/journal_club/2014/10/20/are_liberals_or_conservatives_more_anti-vaccine_108905.html

[Boomhauer]

the anti-vax people were almost always white women, presumably educated.

They are the ones that primarily share all of the anti vaccination, anti GMO, "wierd health tricks that will make doctors hate you" and the various moronic "homeopathic cures that doctor's don't want you to know about it", fad diets, and so forth on Facebook and through chain emails.

[Perd Hapley]

They are the ones that primarily share all of the anti vaccination, anti GMO, "wierd health tricks that will make doctors hate you" and the various moronic "homeopathic cures that doctor's don't want you to know about it", fad diets, and so forth on Facebook and through chain emails.

Makes sense. Same ones that are worried about high-capacity, military-grade gonkulators. WITH BAYONET LUGS!

[makattak]

They are the ones that primarily share all of the anti vaccination, anti GMO, "wierd health tricks that will make doctors hate you" and the various moronic "homeopathic cures that doctor's don't want you to know about it", fad diets, and so forth on Facebook and through chain emails.

People have too much leisure and not enough working to stave off starvation and death with a side of fear of disease that can strike anyone dead at any time with no remedies available.

Not to worry though- we'll be there again soon enough.

[zxcvbob]

military-grade gonkulators

Great word.  I havent heard used in years.

[MechAg94]

People have too much leisure and not enough working to stave off starvation and death with a side of fear of disease that can strike anyone dead at any time with no remedies available.

Not to worry though- we'll be there again soon enough.

I was thinking along the lines of people think they are smart enough to understand medical issues but really aren't.  They start reading "stuff" about vaccines, can't differentiate fact from fiction, and won't or can't talk to their doctor about which is correct. 

It reminds me of all the people I have had show me links that "back up" or "prove" their global waming claims.  When you look at the link, it either has no facts at all or is so full of "maybe" and "we think" language that you realize the people writing the article don't know anything either.  The alternative is articles that absolutely prove something, but not what they are claiming, though they act like it does.

[MechAg94]

Sometimes I think maybe my mother is the only person left who actually remembers and applies stuff her grandmother taught her about cleanliness and illness.  I think some of the problems are a complete lack of education and parents who don't teach their kids anything. 

[KD5NRH]

Q2A: "Do you think corn that can make this organic pesticide on its own is safer to eat than crops treated with more traditional organophosphate insecticide, a chemical class created during WWII mostly intended to kill other human beings but was also adopted to kill insects?"

I'm waiting for cornacco, the naturally nicotine-laced corn.

If you can make it also produce caffeine and a mild painkiller, I'll eat my veggies every day.

[zxcvbob]

I'm waiting for cornacco, the naturally nicotine-laced corn.

"Holy Moses! It DOES taste like Grandma!"

[Mannlicher]

this kind of stuff reminds me that many scientists are educated far beyond their intelligence.