Author Topic: Portland ...  (Read 38545 times)

Ben

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 42,217
  • I'm an Extremist!
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #25 on: July 17, 2020, 12:42:35 PM »
All I have to say is that when the Portland Mayor demands that Trump cough up Federal funds to repair damage to the city, Trump actually sends a tweet that says, "Stick it up your ass, you hippie buffoon!"

https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2020/07/17/portland-ore-mayor-ted-wheeler-is-aware-undesirable-people-are-in-his-city-and-wishes-theyd-leave-dhs-leadership/
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

MechAg94

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 31,842
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #26 on: July 17, 2020, 12:55:41 PM »
I'm increasingly not OK with this. I think both the federal and state governments have been overstepping their bounds for a very long time. Protesting and rioting are two different things.  But policing and extra-judicial abduction are also two different things.

To answer your second question, in many places the damage is done and it is too late, regardless of who started the cycle of disrespect, to expect friendly relations between the police and the populace.  There are too many blatantly obvious differences between what the police can get away with and the behaviors the rest of us are allowed to engage in.  There has been too much "us vs. them" for too long. 

On the last, the only answer I can come up with is the govt started it and by extension the busy body voters who wanted a law against everything they didn't like.  Whether it be using police as petty tax/fee collectors/enforcers or the War on Drugs, police were asked to enforce all sorts of things and allowed to intrude more in people's lives to do it.  Then we have/had stupid judges who have turned the Bill of Rights into a giant gray area where nothing is straightforward or simple. 

Fixing it would require a significant change in legislative action and judicial oversight.  I don't see that happening quickly.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

fifth_column

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1,672
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #27 on: July 17, 2020, 01:17:08 PM »
Apparently, I'm more disturbed by the idea of federal authorities in rental cars making arrests than I originally thought.  It occurs to me that if we're to assume the feds were acting lawfully and that the protester was actually a hardened criminal deserving of incarceration, then it's just as easy to assume that since antifa has been declared a terrorist organization, and since membership can be implied by virtue of being in the crowd, it's just as likely the guy in that snippet of a video is being treated as an enemy combatant and has been essentially disappeared.  The federal government has done it many times, and it's been documented.  It's become nearly impossible for me to give the state the benefit of the doubt anymore. 
Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will... The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress. ― Frederick Douglass

No American citizen should be willing to accept a government that uses its power against its own people.  -  Catherine Engelbrecht

RoadKingLarry

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 21,144
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #28 on: July 17, 2020, 01:41:39 PM »
With the way the MSM distorts reality it would not surprise me to find out that the animal seed/feed they were throwing at police had already been processed by the animals.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

Big Hairy Bee

  • friend
  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 253
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #29 on: July 18, 2020, 06:39:41 PM »

Ron

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 10,562
  • Like a tree planted by the rivers of water
    • What I believe ...
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #30 on: July 19, 2020, 11:21:29 AM »
Well yes, I was referring to the footage as presented.  Regardless of words said that we're not aware of, this activity does not bode well for the "No, really, we're not living in a police state" argument . . .

Representative government, rule of law and inalienable rights were useful fictions to keep a reasonably well educated populace mollified.

Our hidden rulers seem less inclined these days to exert any energy on maintaining that facade. They've imported enough folks from egalitarian tyrannies and converged our educational system enough that the people now demand egalitarian tyranny as their primary right.

We're all fascists and communists now, some nationalist, some globalist.



 

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead

Angel Eyes

  • Lying dog-faced pony soldier
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 11,336
  • You're not diggin'
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #31 on: July 19, 2020, 01:02:55 PM »

"Let me start off with two words: made in America."
                             - Joe Biden

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 12,729
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #32 on: July 19, 2020, 04:33:48 PM »
FYI:  The twit that the feds dragged away in their soccer-mom-mobile was released shortly thereafter when it was determined he wasn't the twit they were seeking.  Apparently the feds have some specific folks they are looking for.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

dogmush

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 12,084
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #33 on: July 19, 2020, 04:39:50 PM »
FYI:  The twit that the feds dragged away in their soccer-mom-mobile was released shortly thereafter when it was determined he wasn't the twit they were seeking.  Apparently the feds have some specific folks they are looking for.

Honestly not sure if that's better or worse...

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 12,729
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #34 on: July 19, 2020, 04:53:02 PM »
Honestly not sure if that's better or worse...

It would be nice if they could round up and charge some of the organizers and instigators of the riots and lay some federal charges on them.  I doubt it would do much to quiet the rioting, but to hear about some convictions would be highly satisfying.
Portland is my home town, born there many years ago.  It saddens me greatly to see it devolve into a left wing-led cesspool when it was such a nice place to grow up and live in years back.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 12,729
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #35 on: July 21, 2020, 09:18:18 AM »
It looks like the "Silent Majority" are finally making themselves heard in Portland.  Unfortunately, they are coming out on the side of the, er... "protesters".

https://www.foxnews.com/us/thousands-march-protest-downtown-portland

edited for spelling
« Last Edit: July 26, 2020, 07:35:15 PM by RocketMan »
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

Ben

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 42,217
  • I'm an Extremist!
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #36 on: July 21, 2020, 09:22:31 AM »
It looks like the "Silent Majority" are finally making themselves heard in Portland.  Unfortunately, they are coming out on the side of the, er... "protestors".

https://www.foxnews.com/us/thousands-march-protest-downtown-portland

I don't know that they're part of the silent majority. They mostly remind me of the older, wealthy, naive liberals that I used to see in Santa Barbara - saving the world with signs in front of the courthouse, then hitting Starbucks and the Trader Joe's to talk about the great work they've done for their fellow travelers.
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 26,052
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #37 on: July 21, 2020, 09:26:44 AM »
Cognitive dissonance. From RocketMan's link:

Quote
"I found it wrong that the federal government was trying to come here and prevent people from protesting and exercising their right to assemble and protest," mom Megan Kelly told Portland's KATU.

But are the feds preventing people from peacefully assembling and protesting?

Quote
The city's Democrat leadership has been criticized for its response. “The elected officials have condoned the destruction and chaos” in the city, said Daryl Turner, the head of the Portland Police Association, on Sunday.

...

Demonstrators said they would remain nonviolent and protest as long as federal officers are in the city, the station reported.

Just before midnight, the unrest began to swell as protesters were seen knocking and coming close to the courthouse building, which resulted in federal officers setting off smoke gas, according to The Oregonian.

Some people started to tear off the plywood in front of the building around 12:20 a.m., which prompted police to throw devices that emitted smoke and an orange substance into the air.

...

Police would later acknowledge that federal law enforcement deployed CS gas, also known as tear gas, and advised people to avoid the area of SW 3rd and SW Main. They reported people were throwing projectiles and some were armed with clubs, hammers, and other weapons.

But I'm sure those were peaceful, non-violent clubs, hammers, and other weapons.
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
100% Politically Incorrect by Design

WLJ

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 20,525
  • On Patrol In The Epsilon Eridani System
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #38 on: July 21, 2020, 09:36:52 AM »
Quote
Police would later acknowledge that federal law enforcement deployed CS gas, also known as tear gas, and advised people to avoid the area of SW 3rd and SW Main. They reported people were throwing projectiles and some were armed with clubs, hammers, and other weapons.

But I'm sure those were peaceful, non-violent clubs, hammers, and other weapons.

No MAGA hats means they're thrown with love and tolerance.
"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us".
- Calvin and Hobbes

dogmush

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 12,084
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #39 on: July 21, 2020, 10:11:33 AM »
While I acknowledge Ben's points about the Federal stuff belonging to all of us not just Portland (from reply 21) I gotta kind of wonder if it wouldn't be better to just let the Portlanders burn Portland down, and let Oregon deal with the aftermath.  Not EVERYTHING needs to be a federal problem, and in the grand scheme of federal dollars a couple buildings is pretty small change.

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 12,729
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #40 on: July 21, 2020, 10:18:22 AM »
I've thought the same thing, just let Portland burn, let the Idiocracy that lives there deal with the aftermath. Unfortunately, I have family, including three of my kids, that live in communities surrounding Portland. This stuff could begin to affect them in a bad way at some point.

And regarding the "Silent Majority", I've never been convinced that they really exist as a cohesive group. In my opinion, they are mostly just low information, uninvolved folks that vote their feelings.
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

Ben

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 42,217
  • I'm an Extremist!
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #41 on: July 21, 2020, 10:20:38 AM »
While I acknowledge Ben's points about the Federal stuff belonging to all of us not just Portland (from reply 21) I gotta kind of wonder if it wouldn't be better to just let the Portlanders burn Portland down, and let Oregon deal with the aftermath.  Not EVERYTHING needs to be a federal problem, and in the grand scheme of federal dollars a couple buildings is pretty small change.

Actually on one hand I 100% agree with you. I'd love to see the feds say, "You want it, you got it" and leave Portland, let the buildings burn, and never return to them. On the other hand, there's no way that will happen without the result being that Portland/Oregon gets a bajillion of our tax dollars to rebuild.

The part of me that says people need to learn their lessons without getting bailed out would very much like to see Portland left in ruins (apologies to our members or their families with Portland connections - if it helps, I have always wished the same for CA), but the part of me that knows I'll end up paying for it would just as soon see the fed cops bash some heads to divert the rioters from fed buildings to city of Portland buildings. Though we saw the one time the Mayor got tough is when the protestors were on their way to his house.

I am still hoping that Trump tells Oregon to get bent when they demand hundreds of millions of federal dollars in relief.
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

makattak

  • Dark Lord of the Cis
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,022
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #42 on: July 21, 2020, 12:29:08 PM »
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2020/07/21/fed-goons-out-of-pdx-scenes-from-last-nights-rioting-in-portland-video/

More scenes from last night's riot.

In the reporting, they said the Fed's rushed out and attacked the rioters attempting to break in.

I had to do some digging, but I actually found some footage of that:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6XicBBN1l4&t=2m26s
I wish the Ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened.

So do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us. There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring. In which case, you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought

TechMan

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,553
  • Yes, your moderation has been outsourced.
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #43 on: July 21, 2020, 12:58:36 PM »
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2020/07/21/fed-goons-out-of-pdx-scenes-from-last-nights-rioting-in-portland-video/

More scenes from last night's riot.

In the reporting, they said the Fed's rushed out and attacked the rioters attempting to break in.

I had to do some digging, but I actually found some footage of that:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6XicBBN1l4&t=2m26s

LOL 
Quote
Hawkmoon - Never underestimate another person's capacity for stupidity. Any time you think someone can't possibly be that dumb ... they'll prove you wrong.

Bacon and Eggs - A day's work for a chicken; A lifetime commitment for a pig.
Stupidity will always be its own reward.
Bad decisions make good stories.

Quote
Viking - The problem with the modern world is that there aren't really any predators eating stupid people.

MechAg94

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 31,842
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #44 on: July 21, 2020, 01:00:56 PM »
FYI:  The twit that the feds dragged away in their soccer-mom-mobile was released shortly thereafter when it was determined he wasn't the twit they were seeking.  Apparently the feds have some specific folks they are looking for.
From some additional stuff I have seen, the Feds in camo were wearing patches identifying their department and badge numbers.  While they were in camo, they were not unidentified.
“It is much more important to kill bad bills than to pass good ones.”  ― Calvin Coolidge

RocketMan

  • Mad Rocket Scientist
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 12,729
  • Semper Fidelis
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #45 on: July 21, 2020, 01:21:52 PM »
From some additional stuff I have seen, the Feds in camo were wearing patches identifying their department and badge numbers.  While they were in camo, they were not unidentified.

I think that's always been the case.  They just haven't been very vocal when they haul off a miscreant.  (Which is cool in a way.    >:D )
If there really was intelligent life on other planets, we'd be sending them foreign aid.

Conservatives see George Orwell's "1984" as a cautionary tale.  Progressives view it as a "how to" manual.

My wife often says to me, "You are evil and must be destroyed." She may be right.

Liberals believe one should never let reason, logic and facts get in the way of a good emotional argument.

K Frame

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 40,912
  • I Am Inimical
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #46 on: July 21, 2020, 01:35:27 PM »
A few of my more... liberal... Facebook friends (including a friend from college) are losing their minds over "Trump's Secret Police."

 :facepalm:
Carbon Monoxide, sucking the life out of idiots, 'tards, and fools since man tamed fire.

WLJ

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 20,525
  • On Patrol In The Epsilon Eridani System
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #47 on: July 21, 2020, 01:40:21 PM »
A few of my more... liberal... Facebook friends (including a friend from college) are losing their minds over "Trump's Secret Police."

 :facepalm:

All the cool fascist have them
"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us".
- Calvin and Hobbes

K Frame

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 40,912
  • I Am Inimical
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #48 on: July 21, 2020, 01:44:36 PM »
Of course, they're not saying word one about the use of Bill and Janet's "secret police" in Waco, Texas...
Carbon Monoxide, sucking the life out of idiots, 'tards, and fools since man tamed fire.

WLJ

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 20,525
  • On Patrol In The Epsilon Eridani System
Re: Portland ...
« Reply #49 on: July 21, 2020, 02:04:23 PM »
"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us".
- Calvin and Hobbes