Author Topic: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...  (Read 4819 times)

Manedwolf

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Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« on: March 13, 2007, 06:00:06 AM »
..and when one is told they can't log onto radical websites, they explode.

No, I'm not kidding. It sounds like a bad joke's intro, though, doesn't it?

Quote
Suicide bomber strikes internet cafe

March 12, 2007 - 3:33PM

A suicide bomber blew himself up, wounding up to three other people, after being prohibited from consulting radical websites at a Casablanca Internet cafe, Moroccan officials and police said today.

There was no immediate claim of responsibility for the attack yesterday evening, in which the bomber was killed.

Two people entered the Internet cafe in the Casablanca suburb of Sidi Moumen and tried to access radical websites, but were prohibited from doing so by the son of the cafe's owner, police said.

"One of the two individuals was then blown apart by explosives hidden under his clothes and died on the spot," said a police official.


The other person, only slightly injured, fled the scene but was later arrested by security services.

Those wounded in the attack were taken to hospital and an investigation into the blast was opened, the official said.

The blast was the first terror attack to cause injuries in Casablanca since a series of suicide bombings blamed on Islamic militants on May 16, 2003, killed 45 people including 13 suicide bombers. Dozens of people were wounded in those attacks.

Moroccan officials have regularly announced in 2006 and 2007 the dismantlement of terrorist cells in the country.


AFP


crt360

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2007, 07:03:59 AM »
If a suicide bomber kills only himself in an attack, does he still get the 72 virgins and other promised good stuff or does he get something like a dozen worn out hookers and a case of Thunderbird?

Is a female suicide bomber given the same post-life benefits as a male martyr?
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Sindawe

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2007, 07:28:29 AM »
Now THAT is the mother of all temper tantrums.
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De Selby

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2007, 07:31:07 AM »
They may have been agents of our "ally" the King. 

Secularist dictators in Muslim lands who support the US tend to hate that whole free speech thing.  Can't let those pesky religious groups keep demanding democracy and government transparency, after all.
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

K Frame

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2007, 07:47:13 AM »
"Is a female suicide bomber given the same post-life benefits as a male martyr?"

That was actually discussed in a news story I read about 2 years ago. Not sure of the source anymore, but the answer is no, they don't. What would they get, 72 penises? BIG TIME contrary to the prevailing Arab view that only men are sexual and that women are at best, chattle, at worst, whores.
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CAnnoneer

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2007, 08:21:01 AM »
Quote
They may have been agents of our "ally" the King. Secularist dictators in Muslim lands who support the US tend to hate that whole free speech thing.  Can't let those pesky religious groups keep demanding democracy and government transparency, after all.

Look at the furious spin.  laugh

Manedwolf

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2007, 08:21:55 AM »
They may have been agents of our "ally" the King. 

Secularist dictators in Muslim lands who support the US tend to hate that whole free speech thing.  Can't let those pesky religious groups keep demanding democracy and government transparency, after all.

I am seriously beginning to wonder about your allegiances.

De Selby

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2007, 08:27:23 AM »
Manedwolf,

What could possibly, even a little bit, make my allegiances suspect about that comment?  Highlighting that maybe third world dictators aren't interested in helping us spread democracy makes me suspect how?
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

Perd Hapley

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #8 on: March 13, 2007, 09:19:58 AM »
Which religious groups are promoting democracy and govt. transparency in the Mid-East? 
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De Selby

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2007, 09:54:32 AM »
fistful, 

regionwide, the Al Ikhwan is promoting it heavily.  They're the big name group that most people will recognize.

In morocco specifically, the PJD is one of the main agitators for open elections.
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

Manedwolf

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2007, 10:54:38 AM »
fistful, 

regionwide, the Al Ikhwan is promoting it heavily.  They're the big name group that most people will recognize.

In morocco specifically, the PJD is one of the main agitators for open elections.

Of course I recognize al-Ikhwan, that group's full name being Jamiat al-Ikhwan al-Muslimun. They're the parent group of Hamas, Gama'a al-Islamiya, and Islamic Jihad. Their teachings have nothing to do with democracy, rather, they've been one of the most important historical contributors to the push to return to fundamentalism and sharia law. Sharia law is NOT democracy.

Who has been brainwashing and/or converting you to believe this tripe? Seriously?

De Selby

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2007, 11:00:07 AM »
Manedwolf,

Sorry, but Islamic Jihad and Gama'a Islamiya are not part of the Brotherhood.  They were militants who split off after the brotherhood formally abandoned violence a few decades ago.

Hamas has a clear track record of agitating for, demanding, and participating in democratic elections, and yes, it is a Muslim Brotherhood sub-chapter.  The larger party shares Hamas's interest in democracy. 

You're calling it tripe, but I don't see even an attempt to claim that these groups don't want votes.  Are you disputing that point, or are you just upset that I pointed out that groups you don't like are actually in favor of democracy?

To address the point you edited in:

Quote
Their teachings have nothing to do with democracy, rather, they've been one of the most important historical contributors to the push to return to fundamentalism and sharia law. Sharia law is NOT democracy.

This comment makes no sense.  It's like saying "common law is not democracy!".  Uh, well, no, it's a legal system...a kind of legal system, no less, in which there are many different traditions and sources of authority.  There is no such thing as one single, identifiable "Shariah government!", past an endtimes scenario similar to that believed by most Christians. 

They do not want laws an American liberal would consider essential to a well-ordered society, that's for sure, but that doesn't have anything to do with whether or not they want elections and transparent government.  I don't get this mental disconnect here--what law of the universe says that only American style political parties with enlightenment era visions of personal liberty can believe in democracy?
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

CAnnoneer

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2007, 11:02:40 AM »
Quote
I am seriously beginning to wonder about your allegiances.

You are catching up. Do a few searches on his points in APS and THR.

Manedwolf

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2007, 11:07:24 AM »
Hamas has a clear track record of agitating for, demanding, and participating in democratic elections, and yes, it is a Muslim Brotherhood sub-chapter.  The larger party shares Hamas's interest in democracy. 

Are you saying that Hamas is NOT a terrorist organization? Yes, or no?

Manedwolf

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2007, 11:10:07 AM »
Quote
I am seriously beginning to wonder about your allegiances.

You are catching up. Do a few searches on his points in APS and THR.

So I see. I'm just having flashbacks of that Dutch caucasian girl who was recruited, converted, was deceived and brainwashed, and ended up going to Iraq to blow herself up as a suicide bomber.

The funny thing about brainwashed people is that they never realize it, they always think they're reasoning for themselves.

De Selby

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #15 on: March 13, 2007, 11:11:01 AM »
Manedwolf,

Okay, "terrorist" means "attacks civilians intentionally to effect political goals", right?

Is it not possible that a group can promote democracy AND use terrorism against others?  I don't see what Hamas's being a terrorist organization has to do with its stance on democracy.  "Terrorist" doesn't mean "hates democracy".
"Human existence being an hallucination containing in itself the secondary hallucinations of day and night (the latter an insanitary condition of the atmosphere due to accretions of black air) it ill becomes any man of sense to be concerned at the illusory approach of the supreme hallucination known as death."

garyk/nm

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #16 on: March 13, 2007, 04:20:22 PM »
Do we have an ignore feature on this forum? I looked, couldn't find one.

If you feed them, they'll never leave.

Antibubba

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #17 on: March 13, 2007, 08:49:02 PM »

Quote
Two people entered the Internet cafe in the Casablanca suburb of Sidi Moumen and tried to access radical websites, but were prohibited from doing so by the son of the cafe's owner, police said.

"One of the two individuals was then blown apart by explosives hidden under his clothes and died on the spot," said a police official.
 


I'll bet he was a big fan of FireWire.
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Winston Smith

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #18 on: March 13, 2007, 10:14:31 PM »
Umm

How is disagreeing with the established norm trolling?

Why don't you factually disprove his points rather than calling him names or marginalizing him by calling him brainwashed? Brainwashed, like he's the one not addressing facts.

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Manedwolf

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #19 on: March 14, 2007, 04:04:23 AM »
Umm

How is disagreeing with the established norm trolling?

Why don't you factually disprove his points rather than calling him names or marginalizing him by calling him brainwashed? Brainwashed, like he's the one not addressing facts.



Well, for starters, he began with a wild apologist conspiracy theory, and then went on to defend Hamas.


Ron

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #20 on: March 14, 2007, 06:32:49 AM »
I would prefer a dialog instead of name calling myself. SS has (I believe) a wife and family from the ME so gets a little touchy.

The fact that I disagree with just about everything he writes doesn't mean I should call him names.

I don't think questioning allegiances is out of bounds either, especially when one appears to defend Hamas.


CAnnoneer

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #21 on: March 14, 2007, 08:44:48 AM »
Quote
SS has (I believe) a wife and family from the ME so gets a little touchy.

1) A-ha!
2) Is that supposed to be an excuse for consistent anti-Americanism, demagogic subversive propaganda, and support/approval of terrorists who kill and maim our soldiers as we speak?
3) Perhaps the family should move back to ME where they will find a more agreeable ambiance, become local citizens, and return their American passports. It would be more honest that way. In exchange, we can have some middle-easterners, like some of my colleagues, who do see that America is the best freest country to live in.

Strings

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #22 on: March 14, 2007, 10:17:03 AM »
Ok, let me make sure I understand this:

 SS says something about the push for democracy in the ME, mentioning the parent group of Hamas. Eveyone wants to question his loyalty to America because of this?

 Guys... don't you think democracy might be beneficial to a group like Hamas? Remember the old quote: "Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. Liberty is an armed sheep contesting the vote". SS has NOT said that Hamas is pushing for liberty, or an American style republic, but for democracy...

Manedwolf

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #23 on: March 14, 2007, 10:18:32 AM »
Guys... don't you think democracy might be beneficial to a group like Hamas? Remember the old quote:

Nope. I think a hail of JDAMs, Hellfires, Tomahawks and Daisy Cutters would be beneficial to a group like Hamas.

You cannot negotiate with fanatical belief-based terrorists, only eliminate them. You need to make an example of them by destroying them utterly, just as the British had to destroy the Thugee cult way back then. People will stop associating with them if association means death. The end.

Otherwise they will destroy you. They'll shake hands with you, and the other will be hiding a knife behind their back for the moment you turn around. Appeasement is seen as weakness, and will be exploited. The UK and most of Europe are learning this the hard way.

If history has proven anything, it's NEVER to trust any of the Islamist militant groups in the region.

So here's a similar historical problem:

Quote
Thuggee (or tuggee) (from Hindi thag thief, from Sanskrit sthaga scoundrel, from sthagati to conceal) was an Indian network of secret fraternities who were engaged in murdering and robbing travellers, operating from the 17th century (possibly as early as 13th century) to the 19th century whose members were known as Thugs. This is the origin of the term "thug", as many Indian words passed into common English during British Imperial rule of India.

And this was the British solution:
Quote
The Thuggee cult was suppressed by the British rulers of India in the 1830s[9], due largely to the efforts of William Sleeman, who started an extensive campaign involving profiling, intelligence, and executions. The campaign was heavily based on informants recruited from captured thugs who were offered protection on the condition that they told everything that they knew. By 1890, the Thug cult was extinct, but the concept of 'criminal tribes' and 'criminal castes' is still in use in India.[10] A police organisation known as the 'Thuggee and Dacoity Department' was established within the Government of India and remained in existence until 1904 when it was replaced by the Central Criminal Intelligence Department. The defeat of the Thuggees played a part in securing Indian loyalty to the British Raj.

Previous attempts at prosecuting and eliminating the thugs had been largely unsuccessful
due to the lack of evidence for their crimes. The thugs' modus operandi yielded very little evidence: no witnesses, no weapons, and no corpses. Besides, the thugs usually made no confessions when captured. Another main reason was the fact that thug groups did not act locally, but all over the Indian subcontinent, including territories that did not belong to British India in combination with the fact that there was then no centralized criminal intelligence agency.

Ron

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Re: Two Muslims walk into an internet cafe...
« Reply #24 on: March 14, 2007, 10:40:29 AM »
Quote
SS says something about the push for democracy in the ME, mentioning the parent group of Hamas. Eveyone wants to question his loyalty to America because of this?
There have been other threads where SS has taken some positions that might make one go hmmmm.

You are right though, there is no reason to assume he wants to see sharia law enforced in the US just because he has loyalties to folks in the ME.

Hamas is a terrorist organization first and foremost as far as I am concerned. All of their good works mean nothing to me until they not only stop suicide bombings but also denounce them as a legitimate tactic.

Supporting or defending them is one of those things that make you go hmmmm.