Author Topic: Now, I'm no oil-well drilling engineer... (Read 31340 times)

Bogie · « **on:** May 24, 2010, 09:53:44 PM »

Why don't they package up a whole buncha portland cement in paper bags the size of two-pound bags of sugar, and just dump the whole mess on top of that oil leak?

Or other idea... Drop a big cement dealie down there, open at both ends. Put it over the thing, pour in a buncha cement, and then cap it with something with a nice big pipe/valve on it. Let it all set up, then turn the valve off... The oil can't be under THAT much pressure, can it?

makattak · « **Reply #1 on:** May 24, 2010, 09:56:53 PM »

Quote from: Bogie on May 24, 2010, 09:53:44 PM

Why don't they package up a whole buncha portland cement in paper bags the size of two-pound bags of sugar, and just dump the whole mess on top of that oil leak?

Or other idea... Drop a big cement dealie down there, open at both ends. Put it over the thing, pour in a buncha cement, and then cap it with something with a nice big pipe/valve on it. Let it all set up, then turn the valve off... The oil can't be under THAT much pressure, can it?

I believe the second one is effectively what they did except the valve was on top of the box they dropped on it. That failed.

cassandra and sara's daddy · « **Reply #2 on:** May 24, 2010, 10:04:36 PM »

the stuff coming out is under real pressure

280plus · « **Reply #3 on:** May 24, 2010, 10:05:35 PM »

last I heard the pressures involved with the spewingil part were on the order of 60,000 PSI. What I want to know is why they would send a tube down there not capable of siphoning off even 1/2 the oil. What, we ain't got bigger pipe out there? Why not put a giant funnellike dealie on the end of a larger siphon tube and place it where it captures the bulk of the oil?

never_retreat · « **Reply #4 on:** May 24, 2010, 10:07:57 PM »

One of the big problems is that the oil has a lot of methane and other gases.
As we know Boyle's law. Expanding gases get cold. Cold enough to freeze the water mixed in.
Thats why the pipe leading from that concrete top hat thing froze and the oil just came out around it.

One quick way to stop the leak is through the judicious application of high explosives.
It would crush the ground and the casing sealing it off. Except that it would make the area un-drill able.
Right now they are still siphoning off oil and separating the water and making money. If they destroy the area they are out even more money. Who wants that to happen.
I believe the Russians have stopped similar deep leaks with that method.

Bogie · « **Reply #5 on:** May 24, 2010, 11:15:56 PM »

Well, I still think they're trying to be too complicated...

Wouldn't be that hard to drop a few hundred tons of portland cement on it...

And they tried to stick that big funnel looking thing on top of it with it spewing... Open up the big funnel thing, make it easy to screw a lid with a big ol' pipe/valve on it... Put the lid over the thing, start up the pumps (at a rate of 61,000 psi or somesuch, as long as it is more...), and drop it on... The pour as much portland over the sucker as you can manage, and then see if it holds when you turn the valve down...

kgbsquirrel · « **Reply #6 on:** May 25, 2010, 12:25:49 AM »

Quote from: Bogie on May 24, 2010, 11:15:56 PM

Well, I still think they're trying to be too complicated...

Wouldn't be that hard to drop a few hundred tons of portland cement on it...

And they tried to stick that big funnel looking thing on top of it with it spewing... Open up the big funnel thing, make it easy to screw a lid with a big ol' pipe/valve on it... Put the lid over the thing, start up the pumps (at a rate of 61,000 psi or somesuch, as long as it is more...), and drop it on... The pour as much portland over the sucker as you can manage, and then see if it holds when you turn the valve down...

Just a quick comment on the "rop a few hundred tons of portland cement" idea. The pressure of the oil would just push the cement off it before it cured. A one ton granite block can be lifted by only 3 psi of water. It does make me wonder about the funnel idea though. Long suspended pipe over the leak, big bloody funnel at the bottom, and centrifugal water separators at the top, at least until the well can be capped.

Nitrogen · « **Reply #7 on:** May 25, 2010, 12:33:13 AM »

How about blowing up a 15kt nuke on top of it?

Jim147 · « **Reply #8 on:** May 25, 2010, 12:34:27 AM »

A mile doesn't seem very far unless it's straight down.

jim

AZRedhawk44 · « **Reply #9 on:** May 25, 2010, 02:27:32 AM »

Quote

Long suspended pipe over the leak, big bloody funnel at the bottom,

You mean that 60,000 PSI leak?

The one with more pressure coming out of it than a .454 casull round, pushing 55,000 gallons of crude upwards every day, or 2,500 gallons an hour, 41.6 gallons per minute or 2/3 a gallon per second?

That's 20 times the velocity of your shower's output... or twenty times greater volume in surface area. One of the two.

A big, bendy mile long tube ain't gonna stay in place over that.

Quote from: Nitrogen on May 25, 2010, 12:33:13 AM

How about blowing up a 15kt nuke on top of it?

I think this will be the ultimate solution. Fuse the ground solid underneath it and hammer it with the pressure of a nuke, or perhaps for political reasons (we do have that muslim commie hippie Obama in the White House, after all), we'll use a depth-rigged daisy cutter or MOAB device or other conventional explosive in amazingly high volume.

230RN · « **Reply #10 on:** May 25, 2010, 05:11:03 AM »

Eh! Big deal.

+

=

No esta problaymo.

Terry, 230RN

(Pic credits in properties)

kgbsquirrel · « **Reply #11 on:** May 25, 2010, 05:27:11 AM »

Quote from: AZRedhawk44 on May 25, 2010, 02:27:32 AM

You mean that 60,000 PSI leak?

The one with more pressure coming out of it than a .454 casull round, pushing 55,000 gallons of crude upwards every day, or 2,500 gallons an hour, 41.6 gallons per minute or 2/3 a gallon per second?

Hmm. You're right. How large of a surface area does the oil diffuse to on the way up? Perhaps anchor a large series of oil booms around the area where it's surfacing and then rig the centrifuges to just skim it off the top, separate the water from it and then pump it ashore? Just trying to think up an intermediate way to both stop the spread of the spill and also recover it for processing and use at the same time until the leak can be capped.

geronimotwo · « **Reply #12 on:** May 25, 2010, 06:05:40 AM »

one of the large dredges they use for the beach restorations could get most of the leaking oil. then pump it to a super tanker for separation. no need for a centrifuge as oil and water separates naturally. simply have a pump on the bottom of the tanker pumping out the water, and a pump near the top pumping the oil to another tanker.

280plus · « **Reply #13 on:** May 25, 2010, 06:29:24 AM »

Well this morning they're talking trying to pug it with mud and if that doesn't work we're back to containment dome.

280plus · « **Reply #14 on:** May 25, 2010, 07:38:35 AM »

When I say big funnel thingy I'm thinking big like geodesic dome house size funnel shaped thingy. Like really really big to catch the plume after pressures have dissipated and the majotiry of the gas has bubbled off. Put steering motors on it and drive it around to keep it in the sweet spot if things start to shift.

Doggy Daddy · « **Reply #15 on:** May 25, 2010, 07:51:39 AM »

Like a mega-huge globalindustrial pool cleaner.

DD

280plus · « **Reply #16 on:** May 25, 2010, 08:10:27 AM »

Exactly!

dogmush · « **Reply #17 on:** May 25, 2010, 08:28:42 AM »

Quote from: 280plus on May 25, 2010, 07:38:35 AM

When I say big funnel thingy I'm thinking big like geodesic dome house size funnel shaped thingy. Like really really big to catch the plume after pressures have dissipated and the majotiry of the gas has bubbled off. Put steering motors on it and drive it around to keep it in the sweet spot if things start to shift.

Let me get this straight:

You want someone to design and buiold the worlds biggest ROV (by an order of magnitude) that is capable of a neutral boyancy hover in 5000 ft of water over a pressurized liquid plume. It needs to be capable of maintaing close to neutral bouancy while varying amounts of gass at varing pressures are bubbling around it (changeing the water density) It needs some kind of automated guidence system to track the plume or a seperate ROV for human piloting, 5000ft of power, control and communication cable, and a ship with a derrick capable of supporting said ROV.

In addition it needs to ba stable enough at depthe that we can attache a 5000ft siphon tube to it and pump the high pressure oil out. Oh, and the guidance system has to be able to compensate for the changing pressure inside the house sized dome from the pumping.

I'm not an engineer either, but it sounds easy enough. Get Kaylee on it.

280plus · « **Reply #18 on:** May 25, 2010, 08:45:42 AM »

Yup, what's so hard about that?

In reality I'd think distance and size are your friend. The farther up you can capture the plume the less complicated it becomes as pressures decrease and gas bubbles off. So the bigger the better.
Think umbrella measurd in acres as another example. First we'll need a really big spring to pop it open.

I'd want to put it in at a point where most of the stuff rising is oil at slow speed and not being affected anymore by the pressures and velocities right at the source. Intead induce it to flow to the umbrella by the pumping creating a lower pressure area in the dome. Just like Doggy Daddy said, a great big pool vacuum. So we'll need a really big brush too.

grampster · « **Reply #19 on:** May 25, 2010, 09:45:45 AM »

Just get a Dutchman and have him put his finger in the hole. Worked on the dikes.

Jim147 · « **Reply #20 on:** May 25, 2010, 10:54:52 AM »

Why doesn't the .gov just print up $700 Trillion and dump it right on top of the well?

That should fix it.

jim

Bogie · « **Reply #21 on:** May 25, 2010, 11:24:08 AM »

Quote

Let me get this straight:

You want someone to design and buiold the worlds biggest ROV

We're Americans. We can do anything...

Okay. How is "mud" different from portland cement?

And I still think that a "gradual shut off" could be interesting...

3 psi can lift a ton? Okay. We'll need more tons.

dogmush · « **Reply #22 on:** May 25, 2010, 11:32:08 AM »

Quote from: Bogie on May 25, 2010, 11:24:08 AM

We're Americans. We can do anything...

That's the problem: British Petroleum.

Cromlech · « **Reply #23 on:** May 25, 2010, 11:42:21 AM »

Oi!

Battle Monkey of Zardoz · « **Reply #24 on:** May 25, 2010, 01:04:06 PM »

Quote

oil can't be under THAT much pressure, can it?

yes is can and is.

The idea of pumping drilling mud, weighted heavier than the oil and heavy enough to stop the flow, is a good plan. If it works. They can chase the oil with cement, weighted more than the mud and just maybe it will work.

News:

Author Topic: Now, I'm no oil-well drilling engineer... (Read 31340 times)