THR bashing....

[Jamisjockey]

Is it just me, or does it seem like THR is deteriorating pretty quickly into a hangout for myspacers, mall ninjas, and extremists?

[Werewolf]

Maybe...

What is happening IMO is a situation similar to what happened to PC gaming.

Back in the late 70's at the birth of the PC age PC gamers were on average fairly well to do, educated and dedicated to the hobby type folks. Through the 80's and early 90's PC games that were published reflected that audience. Then in the mid 90's the PC explosion happened and every Tom, Dick and dumbass got a PC.

Now most of the games made pander to the mindless masses, graphics whores and twitch fest crowd.

You're seeing the same thing with THR. Since nine one one  more and more people are acquiring firearms for various reasons (a good thing?). A lot of them are looking for information and they stumble into THR. They're a diversified group that does't have the same attitudes, political bent etc as the THR user of even 3 years ago. That is what you are seeing.

I used to play a game called SteelBeasts, a very realistic armor simuluation. Started playing it back in 2000 or so. It could only be purchased on the intenet. The players were mostly 30 or older, serving or ex tankers. When we played online we played it like a tactical simulation. Platoons had a platoon leader and companies had a company commander, and in the rare instance we did Bn level scenarios there was a Bn commander. Players played as units, took orders and in general the game flowed as a wargame should.

Then SteelBeasts went retail and the doom crowd discovered it. Online play rapidly degenerated into free for all shoot em ups. The old timers as we were called became outnumbered by a factor of 100 to 1 and keeping the FPS pukes out of our games became more and more difficult. The mindless masses ruined a great tactical simulation - they did the same thing to the forum.

Same thing is happening on a grander scale to the USA.

Though the moderators of THR are pretty hardcore if they don't wield a very big hammer the culture on THR will change too. Problem with that is I have noticed lately that they are wielding their hammers a bit too freely.

[280plus]

Then in the mid 90's the PC explosion happened and every Tom, Dick and dumbass got a PC.

Hey! I resemble that remark! Plus my name is neither Tom NOR Dick so I must be...



I haven't been spending as much time over at THR as I used to. I'll have to start hanging out there more and see what you guys are talking about. I attribute it to just the fact that it has become much wider known and has collected it's share of "undesirables" (for lack of a better word) over the years. I know them poor mods have their hands full trying to keep the lid on it.

[Stickjockey]

So how can we go about helping the Mods keep that lid in place?

[...has left the building.]

I quit reading "General" and "L&P" a long time ago. It is much more fun to just read the technical forums.

[jefnvk]

I still read the technical forums when I'm looking for information.  Can't say that I have posted over there since about December or January though.

For me, it was too many people that just proclaimed that their argument was the golden truth.  And if you dared to have a different political opinion than them, you were part of the brainwashed masses who couldn't think for themselves.

[SpookyPistolero]

One thing to keep in mind is that this occurrence is fairly seasonal, school has recently let out and all the young-un's, college and high school age, have a lot of free time on their hands.

My opinion is that the best way to keep things a little more 'elevated' on THR is to just ignore, for the most part, all the kids. Don't even respond to a thread called 'M16 vs. AK', etc. If they don't get attention my belief is that they'll go elsewhere to find it, or maybe even get a job or pick up a book instead.

There are, however, a few people outside this easy-to-label group, and I won't even read a thread if I know they've contributed to it. Events like an individual trying to explain to me and others how we were 'sold' our weapons, convinced by a salesman to get things that weren't needed, etc., really made me fed up. Jefvnk pretty much nailed that one on the head.

[Ron]

There is a lot of compaining in L&P about how bad our government is but there is no one offering real alternatives.

I almost started a thread over there called "What shall we do then?"

It is one thing to point out and recognize the problem(s), it is another to offer an alternative to the status quo.

There has been a lot of heat and very little light as of late.

[grampster]

I hope the doofusus don't find this place.  Shhhhhhhhh.

[Werewolf]

There is a lot of compaining in L&P about how bad our government is but there is no one offering real alternatives.

Well - some folks have offered suggestions but invariably the suggestions get the thread locked. :/

[Ron]

It looks to me like people from arfcom are finding THR.

You mean people like Bartholomew Roberts?  

You should qualify that as people from "General Discussion" at arfcom.

[Perd Hapley]

I hope the doofusus don't find this place.  Shhhhhhhhh.

Too late, I've been here from the beginning.

[Smith]

I burned out modding THR a year ago.  It's hard to keep that level of intensity.

[Perd Hapley]

Speaking of modding, who should I finger to mod rangereports.com? I don't want to pick the same people who already do TFL and THR.

Maybe it's gunkid's turn for a change.

[K Frame]

"Maybe it's gunkid's turn for a change."

[Perd Hapley]

What's so funny?

[Perd Hapley]

Blackburn, as usual you are being way too inside.  What forum is this?  comphused.

[Antibubba]

I've been spending less time there myself, but not because of any perceived deterioration.  I'm just at other sites learning stuff I don't know.  I'm trying to learn about precious metals before silver goes to $50/oz, for example.  And I come here for the more freewheeling thoughts and questions.

"One thing to keep in mind is that this occurrence is fairly seasonal, school has recently let out and all the young-un's, college and high school age, have a lot of free time on their hands."

Spooky nails it.

[grampster]

Fistful,
I was not thinking of you at all.    Really, I wasn't.   Heh.  Seriously I wasn't.

I was just hoping that Gunkid would not come back in a new persona.

[Perd Hapley]

Rest easy.  I tired of the gunkid persona long ago.  Besides, there is an army of people impersonating me now.  I haven't pulled that tactical wheelbarrow/customized AR stuff in years, but it seems to be popping up everywhere.  Anyhow, when Bob Dylan wrote a song about me, I knew I had become a legend.

"John Wesley Hardin, was a friend to the poor;
He travelled with a gun in every hand..."

[280plus]

So how can we go about helping the Mods keep that lid in place?

Personally. I just try to be a good boy and not make any more work for them. I also try to nip flame wars etc in the bud when I come across them. Last I knew they were inundated with things lke PMs over "Why did you close my thread etc" and last I heard very few of the PMs are of the friendly sort. I give em all a lot of credit for sticking to it.

[Preacherman]

The mods at THR have been actively discussing the overall "tone" of the place for some weeks now.  We've taken certain steps, like issuing warnings to some of our more blatant offenders, and will probably be doing a large-scale prune of the worst of them in the not too distant future.  It's difficult to strike a balance between encouraging free discussion, and reining in the trolls and those with quasi-trollish tendencies.

I think most of the problem is due to two factors:

1.  The rapid expansion of THR.  From a new forum just three years ago, we're up to well over 8,000 active members, which is going some.  All the newbies haven't yet learned the "High Road" approach to discussion (which we try to teach by example), and some of them never will, I'm afraid.  It makes for moderating headaches.

2.  The refusal to "toe the line" by many individualists.  They insist on saying what they want to say, when, where and how they want to say it.  The fact that it may be inappropriate to do so on THR, or wrong to do so in a particular way, doesn't worry them - they just go ahead and do it.  Since they won't listen, we have to administer a cluebat fairly repeatedly to get the message through.

It is a major load on moderators . . . some have "burned out" and taken either a sabbatical, or resigned permanently.  Those of us still there have brought on new moderators from time to time, and will be doing so again in the near future, I'm sure.  But then we have to choose moderators who will hold to the "High Road" standards we've already established, and make sure that all of us are on the same page, so that there's consistency in moderator actions.

It's quite a job . . .

[jefnvk]

Huh, maybe I'll give it another shot.  Always did like most of the people, just the few problem causers ruined it.

[SpookyPistolero]

Preacherman, to you and any other mods reading, I'd just like to say thanks a million for all the very hard and time consuming work you guys put in. THR is pretty much the only place I actually care about checking in to on a daily basis! Not an easy place to keep clean, I'm sure.

[Art Eatman]

jefnvk, my own pattern when not moderating is to just read those threads of particular interest.  Within them, I tend to ignore the idiots.

When you learn who's an offensive clot, use the "Ignore" feature.  You don't even see their sarcasm or convoluted thinking.

There are just some people who could set Guinness records for density.  Depleted Uranium projectiles would bounce off their skulls like ping-pong balls off concrete.

I started moderating at TFL in 1999and then with THR when we started it.  Anybody who sez I ain't got pretty good self control just ain't thinking.  So far, though, I haven't fallen into the "He's even tempered.  Always mad." category.

The forums about rifles and hunting are play-therapy for me, and I guess they sorta satisfy the school-teacher part of my soul, letting me pass on what I've learned over a bunch of years...

All in all, it's fun.

Art